Ignition Diagnostics at SMA!

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  • Published on Nov 11, 2015
  • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics takes a road trip to NY for a CarQuest seminar on ignition waveforms. Of course a visit to SMA is also on the way!
    Eric O. and I try to apply some of our fresh knowledge to diagnose a misfire on an old Ford truck...
    Then I do a quick mobile diagnostic call for SMA on a crank-no start '91 Honda Accord....
    Fun times! Enjoy!
  • Autos & VehiclesAutos & Vehicles

Comments • 75

  • First Last
    First Last 2 days ago

    If you got the firing order by tracing the cables to the cylinders but the order you wrote down wasn't listed in the scope... could Eric O have misplaced one of the cables and could that cause the problem?

  • Robert Openheimer
    Robert Openheimer 2 months ago

    at $3.95 per plug and a whopping .22 for a #8 flatwasher you are making a killing. 5,000 repairs on that truck and you can pay off your snap-on scan tool.

    • Robert Openheimer
      Robert Openheimer 2 months ago

      Being slightly sarcastic of Eric's invoice. You can do plumbing or carpentry with a few hundred dollars of tools. Mechanics have to spend thousands to be able to do their profession appropriately.

    • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
      Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics  2 months ago +1

      LOL I paid cold hard cash for my Verus so no payments to the Snap-On guy! ;)

  • Garth Clark
    Garth Clark 4 months ago

    Yeah, it seems that little Honda could use some TLC to get it more dependable. Interesting how auto owners will do nothing until things fail. I'm afraid to ask how many miles this one has on it.

  • Norwood E. Jatho, Jr.
    Norwood E. Jatho, Jr. 7 months ago

    DUDE, Ford 385 series engine was the same as the 80’s 302 small block ford. 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8 ! ! ! I actually own two 302 cars, two 302 trucks and a 85 f-250 4x4 with a 460 BBF with 4BBL. The fuel injected 460’s were OBD with no live data, functional tests or any bi-directional capabilities for any scan tools. Great pulling/hauling engines but they drinked gas like alcoholic on binge for days. Best I’ve heard in the city was 6-10 mpg and 10-18 mpg on the highway. Great power with the torque to do just about anything except go fast at the strip.

  • motor head1
    motor head1 8 months ago

    Nice! good gas mileage on them trucks lol
    Had one where coil had bad ground intermittent. Guys threw ton of parts only to find corroded ground on coil block or fender on some Fords.

  • Ronald de Rooij
    Ronald de Rooij 8 months ago

    Still don't understand why Eric O and Ivan do not work together all the time. Eric does not like diagnostics, although he is good at it. And Ivan specialises in diagnostics and is less good wrenching.

  • James Fox
    James Fox 9 months ago

    Nice to have Eric's input. He has excellent diagnostic skills and makes the right calls. Your VERUS was very handy. Nice description of your procedure, thank you.

  • Luis Rocha
    Luis Rocha 10 months ago

    Thanks for the demonstration, I learned a lot from this, and it didn't cost me a dime, well maybe just a little, anyway I appreciate what you do because I didn't have to get out in this cold weather, just sat in the comfort of room with a hot cup of coffee, thanks again, from a would-be back yard mechanic.😊

  • Rex Anderson
    Rex Anderson Year ago +3

    If the timing mark flutters, replace the module.

  • Stuart Cookie
    Stuart Cookie Year ago

    Great vid..at least I found out im not the only one pullin my PIP.

  • Rex Anderson
    Rex Anderson Year ago

    EEC-IV has memory codes. It has KOEO and KOER codes. It has timing advance test. It don't have live test. If you get oxygen sensor rich or lean codes, replace the MAP sensor. If you get improper vacuum to the EGR at idle, replace the charcoal canister purge valve.

  • Bart Young
    Bart Young Year ago

    I wonder if plug wires were mixed up in firing order since they didn't match snapons list.

    • Rex Anderson
      Rex Anderson Year ago

      Bart Young To run the wires w/o a book, turn #1 to TDC on compression stroke on 0 turning in normal direction. Wherever the rotor is pointing, that's #1. Run the wires according to rotation of the rotor, firing order, and cylinder arrangement.

  • jericho
    jericho Year ago

    where can i get a copy of that book?

  • John Bonifas
    John Bonifas Year ago

    Hi Ivan is there anyway you can tell me how to get that book I need mission way forms I like it I have a repair shop and I'd like to review it if you can please reply back to me at John Bonifas W900@gmail.com I've been watching you and Eric old scanner dinner for a while is all new to me

  • Tre Bucketz
    Tre Bucketz Year ago

    do you find increased resistance in old spark plug leads?

  • Marty Mcfly
    Marty Mcfly Year ago

    More like batman and superman

  • Toa Mataafa
    Toa Mataafa Year ago

    Leave it to the Pros..Blessings Ivan.

  • Joseph Quattrocchi
    Joseph Quattrocchi 2 years ago +1

    great video ! Here's a tip for the ignition voltage waveform either secondary or primary . Activate peak detect mode for the individual channel and the scope registers all of the peaks in the waveform. Makes the image a lot crisper to view.

  • steve kelly
    steve kelly 2 years ago +1

    i was drafted into usarmy when i was your age. wtf portagesse militiary

  • richard cranium
    richard cranium 2 years ago

    the tfi on the fender was a modification/recall / lawsuit remedy.when they were mounted on the distributor the'd burn up regularly from heat. still have my special socket ya needed for the mount screws. i suspect the pickup coil may be on its way south. that's how they always started to fail. slight miss under load

  • Jim Zivny
    Jim Zivny 2 years ago

    Good video, love that pickup, I'm looking for an older big block pickup for towing.

  • Jim Zivny
    Jim Zivny 2 years ago

    Good video, love that pickup, I'm looking for an older big block pickup for towing.

  • Vencent Bauer
    Vencent Bauer 3 years ago

    check injectors and o2s.

  • Mike Tunstall
    Mike Tunstall 3 years ago

    That firing order you have is backwards because the distributor on that engine spins counter clockwise. Great channel by the way, I love the puzzles that you encounter.

  • Lao Han Tun
    Lao Han Tun 3 years ago

    l'm old school, love this old truck. Bring back so many memories.

  • Auto DITEX
    Auto DITEX 3 years ago

    Take a look at this : ru-clip.net/video/LDY8hWw8MBU/video.html
    We hope it will be interesting for you.
    Regards,
    CarScope Viso Team

  • working shlub
    working shlub 3 years ago

    nice job..that waveform thing is way beyond me. spark ,fuel and compression i like the basics.

  • John McKamy
    John McKamy 3 years ago +2

    the dream machine out front ( snap on truck)

  • Eddie Martinez
    Eddie Martinez 3 years ago +3

    The order should be on the intake.

  • Mark Ferraro
    Mark Ferraro 4 years ago +3

    Great video Ivan and Eric o. Thanks for sharing

  • eightlegger
    eightlegger 4 years ago

    Turn off those white grids on the Verus! I found them too distracting on mine.

  • Tedybear315
    Tedybear315 4 years ago +3

    Expecting live data with an EEC-4 system? You'll need a 'break out box' and a lot of timeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

  • twoeagle86
    twoeagle86 4 years ago +1

    that sucks, I got a 89 ford F250 with a 460 efi that bucks and stumbles when I take off from a stop. changed coil, cap and rotor, with new plugs and wires but still does it. I deleted the egr from the exhaust to the intake im not sure if maybe that might be it but then again it never made a difference when I deleted It, it just started acting up later on. any thoughts?

    • John Bonifas
      John Bonifas Year ago +1

      You most likely got this problem fixed but you need to look at the Crank sensor that is also called the pick up "assembly unplug spell connector and see what the wait for Mark's like then plug it back in I have done three of them already in the computer is junk

    • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
      Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics  4 years ago +1

      +twoeagle86 Eric was saying the TPS sensors go bad on these trucks too. Look at the signal on a graphing meter...that might have been the issue with the truck in the video as well!

  • David Goldberg
    David Goldberg 4 years ago +17

    When working for Eric, you're supposed to do something with Brakekleen!

  • Ozzstar
    Ozzstar 4 years ago +1

    thumbs up

  • White Tiger
    White Tiger 4 years ago +1

    Great video Ivan. Nice of you to help Eric out.

  • Eric Corse
    Eric Corse 4 years ago +4

    Cool the "A" team

  • Joe Shearer
    Joe Shearer 4 years ago +1

    Could be IAC issue on the ford?

  • Greg J Feeney
    Greg J Feeney 4 years ago

    nice work I suggest you do a scope video

  • Dave Caselli
    Dave Caselli 4 years ago +5

    Firing Order ? COUNTERclockwise ? 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8 ?

  • wysetech2000
    wysetech2000 4 years ago +5

    The firing order on the Ford is 15426378 and was in the list on the Verus. Symptoms sound like the throttle body is real dirty and base idle may be out of adjustment. Looks like the Honda could use a new ignition system as the firing lines were very high. No wonder the coil took a dump. Just my two cents worth.

    • Edward Martinez
      Edward Martinez Year ago +1

      Put me in mind of bad cap and wires.

    • wysetech2000
      wysetech2000 4 years ago +1

      +motoYam82 Years ago I was a drivability tech and performed several tune ups a day. I didn't have time to replace one plug wire at a time so I taught myself most of the popular firing orders and rotations to speed things up. Ford had a couple of different ones but the one I posted was for that engine.

    • wysetech2000
      wysetech2000 4 years ago +1

      +motoYam82 False.

    • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
      Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics  4 years ago +3

      +wysetech2000 Wow you know your Fords! Turns out I had the distributor rotation wrong...on this truck it is indeed COUNTER clockwise!! My mistake. Also on that Accord I should have done a visual inspection on a spark plug for sure...
      Here's a question from our seminar for you:
      True or False: high resistance in a spark plug wire causes a higher kV reading on the firing line.

  • Michael Herbert
    Michael Herbert 4 years ago

    I'd like some info on that course you guys took please. Great video.

  • Trim Jazz
    Trim Jazz 4 years ago

    clean the throttle on that ford? could be a simple fix.

  • stuzman
    stuzman 4 years ago +1

    Nice work Ivan and hopefully you and Ivan can catch that intermittent. Is that book available without taking the course in person? Thanks!

  • Tom OConnor
    Tom OConnor 4 years ago +3

    Your last comments were very relevant as there must have been a reason why the coil went in the first place.Old spark plugs along with leaky Ht leads and bad rotor cap can put enough pressure on the coil to cause a re occurrence of the fault.Intermittent problems are the most difficult of all the faults to diagnose.Nice scope work.

  • Andrea Gili
    Andrea Gili 4 years ago

    Good job :)

  • zoidberg444
    zoidberg444 4 years ago +4

    Who would have thought a 1990's ford could survive the rust for so many years.

  • tracycolorado
    tracycolorado 4 years ago

    Good test on that Honda , you have to ensure the coil is good or bad , before you go chasing a Crank or Cam Sensor

  • Greg J Feeney
    Greg J Feeney 4 years ago

    I have taken courses with him

    • Greg J Feeney
      Greg J Feeney 4 years ago

      I agree. He knows scannerdanner as well. John is a wise man

    • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
      Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics  4 years ago +1

      +GREG Feeney John G. was a great lecturer! The take-away message was that "everything you think you know...is wrong" haha :) Basically there are no hard truths in diagnostics; there are always exceptions to the rule!

  • Greg J Feeney
    Greg J Feeney 4 years ago

    John is great guy and instructor

  • Garlin Willingham
    Garlin Willingham 4 years ago +1

    Ivan, you and Eric make a good team. Keep your connection and keep on turning out the good and interesting videos. A place I've found with good free videos are at TSTseminars on RU-clip. I particularly like Bill Fulton, Jerry Truglia and Doc Nail for whatever it's worth; but you know this already.

    • STEVE ROB REVIEWS
      STEVE ROB REVIEWS 4 years ago

      Thanks Garlin I'll check it out 👍👍

    • Wayne C
      Wayne C 4 years ago

      +Garlin Willingham They may know, but I didn't know of this one. Thanks.

  • Ken Mueller
    Ken Mueller 4 years ago

    Didya swipe his tripod while you were there?

  • STEVE ROB REVIEWS
    STEVE ROB REVIEWS 4 years ago

    Well done, 👍👍

  • Сергей Клепицкий

    нет ничего лучше картинки 'до и после'. Спасибо.

  • Bill Rimmer
    Bill Rimmer 4 years ago

    Those terms that u were using in reference to secondary wave forms like parade, raster brought back memories from the Heathkit scope I built way back when. I chucked it out perhaps 20 years ago. But now, thanks to u, Scanner Danner and SMA, I wish I would have kept it. I am sure there would have been a way to set it up to observe square waves and many other electrical events going on on the modern system. Oh well. Now I have to start back with one of those little guys AES Wave makes. Wish there was a way to make your iPad a scope. Economically

    • Bart Young
      Bart Young Year ago

      Although I have a PICO, I still use my heath kit on old cars.

    • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
      Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics  4 years ago

      +Bill Rimmer Can a tablet run Pico software? That would be a slick setup! A Paddle Probe from AESwave picks up secondary KV quite well on modern COP systems, as long as you can reach the coils. Otherwise primary current from a main feed is the way to go :)

  • 1quickchevy2
    1quickchevy2 4 years ago

    Nice fix on the Honda! The guys over at TSTseminars have some great wave form vids as well. They recommend triggering on the start of the dwell. falling edge around 6 volts. The wave form doesn't jump around near as much as trying to catch the firing line. Thanks for all your vids!

    • Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
      Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics  4 years ago

      +1quickchevy2 Thanks man! I would say the best trigger point would be on the falling edge of the primary current ramp (or corresponding kV firing line) to keep the spark line steady on the screen. A picture is worth a thousand words!

  • gary smith
    gary smith 4 years ago +15

    the dynamic duo strikes again!!!!!!!